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	<title>Comments on: Sunday in Outer Blogness: Big News Edition!</title>
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	<link>http://latterdaymainstreet.com/2009/03/15/sunday-in-outer-blogness-big-news-edition/</link>
	<description>A Community for Anyone Interested in Mormonism.</description>
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		<title>By: Matt</title>
		<link>http://latterdaymainstreet.com/2009/03/15/sunday-in-outer-blogness-big-news-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-69519</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Mar 2009 20:35:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://latterdaymainstreet.com/?p=505#comment-69519</guid>
		<description>I think in terms of art, the surreal and even sterile â€œpre-taste of what we hope forâ€ makes a profound backdrop to the characterâ€™s sense of loss.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think in terms of art, the surreal and even sterile â€œpre-taste of what we hope forâ€ makes a profound backdrop to the characterâ€™s sense of loss.</p>
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		<title>By: chanson</title>
		<link>http://latterdaymainstreet.com/2009/03/15/sunday-in-outer-blogness-big-news-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-69506</link>
		<dc:creator>chanson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Mar 2009 21:38:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://latterdaymainstreet.com/?p=505#comment-69506</guid>
		<description>update: It looks like Dissenting in Part &lt;a href=&quot;http://dissentinginpart.blogspot.com/2009/03/my-obligatory-big-love-post.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;agrees with me&lt;/a&gt; on which was the most thoughtful Bloggernacle take on this (and was a little more careful than I was with the citation, since the author was actually Matthew Bowman).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>update: It looks like Dissenting in Part <a href="http://dissentinginpart.blogspot.com/2009/03/my-obligatory-big-love-post.html" rel="nofollow">agrees with me</a> on which was the most thoughtful Bloggernacle take on this (and was a little more careful than I was with the citation, since the author was actually Matthew Bowman).</p>
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		<title>By: chanson</title>
		<link>http://latterdaymainstreet.com/2009/03/15/sunday-in-outer-blogness-big-news-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-69503</link>
		<dc:creator>chanson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Mar 2009 19:11:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://latterdaymainstreet.com/?p=505#comment-69503</guid>
		<description>That South Park episode is hilarious!!!  That has got to be one if the funniest Mormon-interest pieces I&#039;ve ever seen!!!

As for &lt;i&gt;September Dawn&lt;/i&gt;, I really don&#039;t feel like bothering with it.  Reviews are pretty much unanimous that it royally sucked, as a film.  Whether it&#039;s &quot;anti-Mormon&quot; or not is pretty much irrelevant to the raw suckage factor.  I know, I know, I haven&#039;t seen it, so I can&#039;t judge, but my brother wrote &lt;a href=&quot;http://latterdaymainstreet.com/?p=110&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;a pretty amusing review of it&lt;/a&gt;, and I trust his judgment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That South Park episode is hilarious!!!  That has got to be one if the funniest Mormon-interest pieces I&#8217;ve ever seen!!!</p>
<p>As for <i>September Dawn</i>, I really don&#8217;t feel like bothering with it.  Reviews are pretty much unanimous that it royally sucked, as a film.  Whether it&#8217;s &#8220;anti-Mormon&#8221; or not is pretty much irrelevant to the raw suckage factor.  I know, I know, I haven&#8217;t seen it, so I can&#8217;t judge, but my brother wrote <a href="http://latterdaymainstreet.com/?p=110" rel="nofollow">a pretty amusing review of it</a>, and I trust his judgment.</p>
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		<title>By: Lisa</title>
		<link>http://latterdaymainstreet.com/2009/03/15/sunday-in-outer-blogness-big-news-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-69502</link>
		<dc:creator>Lisa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Mar 2009 18:55:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://latterdaymainstreet.com/?p=505#comment-69502</guid>
		<description>Chanson: ha! Have you seen the South Park episode? I kept waiting for the other shoe to drop - the punchline. For SP, that was a ridiculously respectful episode. Not entirely accurate, but then again the Church isn&#039;t entirely accurate about its history either.

I want to see September Dawn now. I found the Church&#039;s claim that it played a part in the movie&#039;s demise rather entertaining :D
 
Church PR is very, very convienient.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chanson: ha! Have you seen the South Park episode? I kept waiting for the other shoe to drop &#8211; the punchline. For SP, that was a ridiculously respectful episode. Not entirely accurate, but then again the Church isn&#8217;t entirely accurate about its history either.</p>
<p>I want to see September Dawn now. I found the Church&#8217;s claim that it played a part in the movie&#8217;s demise rather entertaining <img src='http://latterdaymainstreet.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif' alt=':D' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Church PR is very, very convienient.</p>
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		<title>By: chanson</title>
		<link>http://latterdaymainstreet.com/2009/03/15/sunday-in-outer-blogness-big-news-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-69500</link>
		<dc:creator>chanson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Mar 2009 18:33:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://latterdaymainstreet.com/?p=505#comment-69500</guid>
		<description>OK, now that it has been shown, all of the Bloggernacle blogs have written about it again!  I&#039;d link to all the new posts, but...  Well, just click on all the Bloggernacle links in our sidebar to get the full experience.

I&#039;ll just highlight two:  Mormon Coffee &lt;a href=&quot;http://blog.mrm.org/2009/03/hbos-mormon-temple-ceremony-scene/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;posted the clip&lt;/a&gt;, so of course I had to watch it.  Actually, I think it was pretty artfully done, and you get a sense of why this ritual is important to this character.  Personally, I&#039;ve never seen the temple ceremony IRL, but from what I&#039;ve heard about it, it always sounded way more corny than this.

Then, the best of the Bloggernacle reactions was &lt;a href=&quot;http://bycommonconsent.com/2009/03/16/diablogging-matthew-bowman/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;this one&lt;/a&gt;, where Kristine talks about the complexity of the situation and about how the show humanizes a tradition that is unfamiliar to so many.  I especially like the conclusion:

&lt;blockquote&gt;This was not the showâ€™s finest hour as a work of art, but it is perhaps the most interesting, because the several gears here ground more loudly than usual. However, itâ€™s insufficient to simply (as the Newsroom did) lump what happened in this episode in with September Dawn, or either of them with South Park. If nothing else, this affair might convince us that the usefulness of the hypersimplistic term â€œanti-Mormonâ€ is rapidly narrowing.&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OK, now that it has been shown, all of the Bloggernacle blogs have written about it again!  I&#8217;d link to all the new posts, but&#8230;  Well, just click on all the Bloggernacle links in our sidebar to get the full experience.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ll just highlight two:  Mormon Coffee <a href="http://blog.mrm.org/2009/03/hbos-mormon-temple-ceremony-scene/" rel="nofollow">posted the clip</a>, so of course I had to watch it.  Actually, I think it was pretty artfully done, and you get a sense of why this ritual is important to this character.  Personally, I&#8217;ve never seen the temple ceremony IRL, but from what I&#8217;ve heard about it, it always sounded way more corny than this.</p>
<p>Then, the best of the Bloggernacle reactions was <a href="http://bycommonconsent.com/2009/03/16/diablogging-matthew-bowman/" rel="nofollow">this one</a>, where Kristine talks about the complexity of the situation and about how the show humanizes a tradition that is unfamiliar to so many.  I especially like the conclusion:</p>
<blockquote><p>This was not the showâ€™s finest hour as a work of art, but it is perhaps the most interesting, because the several gears here ground more loudly than usual. However, itâ€™s insufficient to simply (as the Newsroom did) lump what happened in this episode in with September Dawn, or either of them with South Park. If nothing else, this affair might convince us that the usefulness of the hypersimplistic term â€œanti-Mormonâ€ is rapidly narrowing.</p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: Chino Blanco</title>
		<link>http://latterdaymainstreet.com/2009/03/15/sunday-in-outer-blogness-big-news-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-69488</link>
		<dc:creator>Chino Blanco</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Mar 2009 07:04:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://latterdaymainstreet.com/?p=505#comment-69488</guid>
		<description>From what I gather from comments here and elsewhere, it sounds like most viewers came away sharing Craig&#039;s impression that the episode served up a fair depiction.

If so, it sounds like maybe somebody&#039;s got a new dilemma to ponder: will anyone notice if/when we quietly edit/remove the evidence of our premature petulance from the Newsroom?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From what I gather from comments here and elsewhere, it sounds like most viewers came away sharing Craig&#8217;s impression that the episode served up a fair depiction.</p>
<p>If so, it sounds like maybe somebody&#8217;s got a new dilemma to ponder: will anyone notice if/when we quietly edit/remove the evidence of our premature petulance from the Newsroom?</p>
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		<title>By: chanson</title>
		<link>http://latterdaymainstreet.com/2009/03/15/sunday-in-outer-blogness-big-news-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-69486</link>
		<dc:creator>chanson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Mar 2009 05:44:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://latterdaymainstreet.com/?p=505#comment-69486</guid>
		<description>Craig -- That&#039;s interesting, I didn&#039;t realize it&#039;s already over.  I&#039;ll be curious to hear other reactions!

Lisa -- Exactly.

Actually, of all of the things one can criticize about the LDS church, the institution of the &quot;LDS Newsroom&quot; is the one that really sticks in my craw.  It ties in with the &lt;a href=&quot;http://latterdaymainstreet.com/?p=506&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;discussion&lt;/a&gt; Andrew and others were having &lt;a href=&quot;http://mormonmatters.org/2009/03/15/why-mormon-doctrine-is-not-mormon-doctrine/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;on McKonkie&#039;s &lt;i&gt;Mormon Doctrine&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/a&gt;:  The leaders discovered that it&#039;s convenient to have a body of quasi-official statements that can be used or denied in accordance with the winds of expediency.  It shields the official leaders from having to make statements on controversial subjects and saves them the whole embarrassing &quot;maybe the prophet was &#039;speaking as a man&#039;&quot; thing when it comes time to pretend they never said XYZ.

Forgive me for using a Seinfeld metaphor, but the thing this most reminds me of was when George Costanza said that wearing sweat pants all the time means that you&#039;ve given up; you&#039;re not even going to try.  The &quot;LDS Newsroom&quot; is the sweatpants of the LDS Church&#039;s integrity.  The church isn&#039;t even trying to be forthright.  They&#039;re not even &lt;i&gt;pretending&lt;/i&gt; to try to be forthright anymore.  P.R. is now their God.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Craig &#8212; That&#8217;s interesting, I didn&#8217;t realize it&#8217;s already over.  I&#8217;ll be curious to hear other reactions!</p>
<p>Lisa &#8212; Exactly.</p>
<p>Actually, of all of the things one can criticize about the LDS church, the institution of the &#8220;LDS Newsroom&#8221; is the one that really sticks in my craw.  It ties in with the <a href="http://latterdaymainstreet.com/?p=506" rel="nofollow">discussion</a> Andrew and others were having <a href="http://mormonmatters.org/2009/03/15/why-mormon-doctrine-is-not-mormon-doctrine/" rel="nofollow">on McKonkie&#8217;s <i>Mormon Doctrine</i></a>:  The leaders discovered that it&#8217;s convenient to have a body of quasi-official statements that can be used or denied in accordance with the winds of expediency.  It shields the official leaders from having to make statements on controversial subjects and saves them the whole embarrassing &#8220;maybe the prophet was &#8216;speaking as a man&#8217;&#8221; thing when it comes time to pretend they never said XYZ.</p>
<p>Forgive me for using a Seinfeld metaphor, but the thing this most reminds me of was when George Costanza said that wearing sweat pants all the time means that you&#8217;ve given up; you&#8217;re not even going to try.  The &#8220;LDS Newsroom&#8221; is the sweatpants of the LDS Church&#8217;s integrity.  The church isn&#8217;t even trying to be forthright.  They&#8217;re not even <i>pretending</i> to try to be forthright anymore.  P.R. is now their God.</p>
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		<title>By: Craig</title>
		<link>http://latterdaymainstreet.com/2009/03/15/sunday-in-outer-blogness-big-news-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-69484</link>
		<dc:creator>Craig</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Mar 2009 04:34:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://latterdaymainstreet.com/?p=505#comment-69484</guid>
		<description>As an ExMormon, the LdS church has no place to tell me or any other person that we aren&#039;t allowed to share our temple experience.  Whether that&#039;s in a personal conversation, or on TV, we have the right to share whatever we wish about our experiences in Mormonism, including the temple ceremony. 

And having seen the episode, I can say that HBO was very fair and neutral in how they portrayed it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As an ExMormon, the LdS church has no place to tell me or any other person that we aren&#8217;t allowed to share our temple experience.  Whether that&#8217;s in a personal conversation, or on TV, we have the right to share whatever we wish about our experiences in Mormonism, including the temple ceremony. </p>
<p>And having seen the episode, I can say that HBO was very fair and neutral in how they portrayed it.</p>
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		<title>By: Hellmut</title>
		<link>http://latterdaymainstreet.com/2009/03/15/sunday-in-outer-blogness-big-news-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-69482</link>
		<dc:creator>Hellmut</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Mar 2009 02:45:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://latterdaymainstreet.com/?p=505#comment-69482</guid>
		<description>I agree with you, Matt.  That predicament is of the brethren&#039;s own making.

If they had not been spinning more gold than Rumpelstilzchen&#039;s princess, they would be less embarrassed by bad news.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with you, Matt.  That predicament is of the brethren&#8217;s own making.</p>
<p>If they had not been spinning more gold than Rumpelstilzchen&#8217;s princess, they would be less embarrassed by bad news.</p>
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		<title>By: Lisa</title>
		<link>http://latterdaymainstreet.com/2009/03/15/sunday-in-outer-blogness-big-news-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-69480</link>
		<dc:creator>Lisa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Mar 2009 01:36:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://latterdaymainstreet.com/?p=505#comment-69480</guid>
		<description>Chanson: Perhaps I misunderstood what you meant by petulant (not the meaning of the word, but how it applies)

I suppose I was thinking of a different part of the reaction which stuck with me particularly. I can see why you&#039;d call it petulant, though I might even go so far as snobbish when they have lines such as this:

&lt;i&gt;Certainly Church members are offended when their most sacred practices are misrepresented or presented without context or understanding.&lt;/i&gt;

Considering most recent events.

Respect *is* a two way street and often you have to give to receive.

I could go on about the official statements and stories given to circumvent the &quot;liberal media&quot; which they believe serves only to distort their side of the story. I have to say I find the media&#039;s spin to be much more palatable than the church&#039;s.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chanson: Perhaps I misunderstood what you meant by petulant (not the meaning of the word, but how it applies)</p>
<p>I suppose I was thinking of a different part of the reaction which stuck with me particularly. I can see why you&#8217;d call it petulant, though I might even go so far as snobbish when they have lines such as this:</p>
<p><i>Certainly Church members are offended when their most sacred practices are misrepresented or presented without context or understanding.</i></p>
<p>Considering most recent events.</p>
<p>Respect *is* a two way street and often you have to give to receive.</p>
<p>I could go on about the official statements and stories given to circumvent the &#8220;liberal media&#8221; which they believe serves only to distort their side of the story. I have to say I find the media&#8217;s spin to be much more palatable than the church&#8217;s.</p>
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